Thank you Evan and Shelagh for these thoughts. It brings to mind this query. Mrs Eddy says ‘ with some individuals the morbid moral or physical symptoms constantly reappear’ S&H p 453. Does that mean that for some people CS can never be a solution? Surely if you have corrected a wrong thought, more harmony should be manifest? I’ve puzzled over this, and would love to hear some thoughts from others, thank you. Happy day to all.
As one who has striven for healing for a number of years now, I too would like to know the interpretation of that statement by Mrs. Eddy. Whenever I read or think of it, I wonder if I’m not healed because I somehow fall into that category as someone who cannot be healed.
Science and Health p. 453
“Mental chemicalization follows the explanation of Truth, and a higher basis is thus won; but with some individuals the morbid moral or physical symptoms constantly reappear.”
You ask about the “morbid moral or physical symptoms,” constantly reappearing. I think it means that when this happens, the error hasn’t been honestly faced yet and dealt with completely. It’s still being clung to somewhere in thought and not fully released.
Healing is always possible for error always yields to the counter Truth that negates it. But sometimes it takes a lot of “prayer and fasting,” to clearly discern the specific truth that negates the troublesome error. Or perhaps, just more honesty about what the real issue is and a willingness to confront it and part with it.
Ah, yes Linda, thank you so much – “fess” I could not find in the dictionary, but “confess”. So it probably means also “admit”. So I understand today`s SV.
Thank you Shelagh for your lovely comment!
It is always very christly and comforting to help a dear child of God to lead out of messy thoughts. I am very grateful if someone helps me out of my uncomfortable messy thoughts to thoughts coming from God.
Thank you Evan to let me learn the spiritual lessons and a new English idiom!
“Honesty is spiritual power. Dishonesty is human weakness, which forfeits divine help. You uncover sin, not in order to injure, but in order to bless the corporeal man;…”
SH 453:16-19 Honesty (to 😉
Uta – “Mess up” is also an idiom meaning to make a mistake or do something wrong. So, the saying means, “If you make a mistake (sin), admit it (or confess it).”
Even humanly, when I have admitted my mistake, I often find forgiveness. I learned this in Sunday school and practiced it as a child. But humility and an apology needs to be part of the confession.
No one is beyond healing- since everyone is a perfect, whole, spiritual complete child of God. Already. I think symptoms reappearing are indications that there is more work to do . As Eddy says , the harder the problem seems to be, to overcome, the stronger should be our faith and the purer our love.
I think somewhere else she states, that error “appears to disappear. “ We are on a spiritual journey out of this false material sense and it is challenging at times. But progress is the Law of God! We are making progress and it is inevitable that we succeed in seeing and demonstrating the Truth that our great teachers so selflessly brought to this world.
God is With us and providing the answers we need every moment. We are never alone!
I find that sometimes when people pray they completely forget to put off that old model of man.
And then he also relates a story from the We Knew Mary Baker Eddy book about Mrs. Eddy instructing her household about the importance of “putting off’ the old (material) man in our thinking instead of just trying to “improve” this material view of man.
I’ve found that a liar will eventually always be exposed. The belief of life in matter is a lie. If we aren’t proactively clearing our thinking of the beliefs of life in matter as they come to the surface, its lies come to the surface in more aggressive forms that *force* us to handle them. For example, material things all eventually die. That is the nature of matter. So if we believe the source of love in our life is some material being, we may suffer severe grief at the loss of love in our life if that material being dies. But if instead we realize our source of love is God, then we will experience continuous, never ending, never dying love in our lives. And we can know that in Spirit nothing ever dies, and therefore the true spiritual idea that may appear to us as a temporary material being never dies either. The same approach can be applied to health, supply, and any other idea that we can be tempted to believe has its source in matter. We can take joy in putting off those “old man” beliefs and realize the true idea that has been there all along and is there now, regardless of what the material (lying) senses may be telling us.
Hi Brian,
This reminds me of a short article by Mrs. Eddy called Foundation Work. Here is a quote from it;
“Early had I learned that whatever is loved materially, as mere corporeal personality, is eventually lost. “For whosoever will save his life shall lose it,” saith the Master. Exultant hope, if tinged with earthliness, is crushed as the moth.”
Ret. 32:5
Thank you for the link to the article. I am looking forward to reading it. 🙂
Thank you awfully for the link to that wonderful article of Mark Swinney!
I just want to point to the following sentence at the end of the article: “So, invite God`s “new man” into your thought and be comforted” from Psalms. Let`s do that!
Thanks a lot Brian for your so inspiring and clear metaphysical comment!
” Your present spirituality, including your invincible expression of God’s perfection, can never really be your goal since it is already and entirely your present standpoint.”
A great reminder!
I have found this topic and the thread of responses extremely beneficial!
“If you mess up, ‘fess up.” Thank you Evan, Shelagh, and Brian. I am “fessing up” – have to find the old man that has to be gotten rid of, as Mark Swinney said:
“The same approach can be applied to health, supply, and any other idea that we can be tempted to believe has its source in matter. We can take joy in putting off those “old man” beliefs and realize the true idea that has been there all along and is there now, regardless of what the material (lying) senses may be telling us.”
I just finished reading Mark’s article again and highly recommend checking it out. The last line is especially helpful to me, “Your present spirituality, including your invincible expression of God’s perfection, can never really be your goal since it is already and entirely your present standpoint.” What a powerful thought that my expression of God’s perfection is “already and entirely” my “present standpoint.”
Thanks, Evan, and all for your contributions. Yes, every time we declare that we are spiritual and perfect, made in God’s image and likeness, we are putting on the “new” man and throwing off the “old.” Honesty, to me, is being pure and guileless, a quality I deeply value. I encouraged this in my children as they were growing up. They have become trustworthy adults. Forgiveness is given when we honestly “fess” up and repent—change our direction. I love this post!
Such sincere, healing reasoning here. Brings to mind this passage in Science and Health (p. 447):
“Expose and denounce the claims of evil in all their forms [especially the claims that I can be sick, selfish, sensual, dishonest, uncaring, lazy, etc.] but realize no reality in them. A sinner is not reformed merely by assuring him he cannot be a sinner because there is no sin.
To put down the claim of sin you must detect it, [fess up]
“remove the mask, [it’s only evil, the liar, claiming to use my face, identity, thoughts, voice, and heart for its own ends]
“point out the illusion [the truth is, there is no other source of identity, thought, or motive but the one all-knowing, all-caring Mind, God, infinite Love, infinite good, filling all time and space, so this evil claiming to use me is nowhere, no one, nothing, and cannot fool me into thinking it is]
“and thus get the victory over sin and so prove its unreality.”
Expose has three important meanings:
1) deprive of food (truth) or shelter (consciousness) 2) Unmask 3) subject to the action of light.
We are all of us, eternally, subject to the action of light. Good stuff!
I recall chatting with a very dear lady, who had made some “not so good” life choices when younger. (Around that time, made judicial recompense)
She was worried about the Bible promise of the truth being made known.
I considered my answer, turning mentally to divine Love for inspiration.
The thought came to me, that Biblically, the truth to be made known, is the Truth of our innocence as Life divine’s reflection.
I shared this thought and was so grateful it brought the needed comfort to this dear one’s concerns ♡
Thank you Evan for today’s lovely view ♡
Thank you Evan and Shelagh for these thoughts. It brings to mind this query. Mrs Eddy says ‘ with some individuals the morbid moral or physical symptoms constantly reappear’ S&H p 453. Does that mean that for some people CS can never be a solution? Surely if you have corrected a wrong thought, more harmony should be manifest? I’ve puzzled over this, and would love to hear some thoughts from others, thank you. Happy day to all.
As one who has striven for healing for a number of years now, I too would like to know the interpretation of that statement by Mrs. Eddy. Whenever I read or think of it, I wonder if I’m not healed because I somehow fall into that category as someone who cannot be healed.
Hi MB,
Science and Health p. 453
“Mental chemicalization follows the explanation of Truth, and a higher basis is thus won; but with some individuals the morbid moral or physical symptoms constantly reappear.”
You ask about the “morbid moral or physical symptoms,” constantly reappearing. I think it means that when this happens, the error hasn’t been honestly faced yet and dealt with completely. It’s still being clung to somewhere in thought and not fully released.
Healing is always possible for error always yields to the counter Truth that negates it. But sometimes it takes a lot of “prayer and fasting,” to clearly discern the specific truth that negates the troublesome error. Or perhaps, just more honesty about what the real issue is and a willingness to confront it and part with it.
Thank you very much Evan for this explanation.
Hi SpiritView Family,
please explain a German girl what it means “to fess up” – thanks
Hi Uta. I think it means ‘to confess’, to be honest and tell the truth. X
Ah, yes Linda, thank you so much – “fess” I could not find in the dictionary, but “confess”. So it probably means also “admit”. So I understand today`s SV.
Thank you Shelagh for your lovely comment!
It is always very christly and comforting to help a dear child of God to lead out of messy thoughts. I am very grateful if someone helps me out of my uncomfortable messy thoughts to thoughts coming from God.
Thank you Evan to let me learn the spiritual lessons and a new English idiom!
“Honesty is spiritual power. Dishonesty is human weakness, which forfeits divine help. You uncover sin, not in order to injure, but in order to bless the corporeal man;…”
SH 453:16-19 Honesty (to 😉
Uta – “Mess up” is also an idiom meaning to make a mistake or do something wrong. So, the saying means, “If you make a mistake (sin), admit it (or confess it).”
Oh yes Joy, thanks a lot! 🙂
Even humanly, when I have admitted my mistake, I often find forgiveness. I learned this in Sunday school and practiced it as a child. But humility and an apology needs to be part of the confession.
No one is beyond healing- since everyone is a perfect, whole, spiritual complete child of God. Already. I think symptoms reappearing are indications that there is more work to do . As Eddy says , the harder the problem seems to be, to overcome, the stronger should be our faith and the purer our love.
I think somewhere else she states, that error “appears to disappear. “ We are on a spiritual journey out of this false material sense and it is challenging at times. But progress is the Law of God! We are making progress and it is inevitable that we succeed in seeing and demonstrating the Truth that our great teachers so selflessly brought to this world.
God is With us and providing the answers we need every moment. We are never alone!
Mrs Eddy said, “…but the BELIEF in sin is punished so long as the BELIEF lasts”. This is my best thought about any “mess”
The comments from MB and Anna today reminded me of a C.S. Sentinel article I read recently about “Your present standpoint” that I’d like to share:
https://sentinel.christianscience.com/shared/view/1v9tizwth04?s=e
Mark Swinney makes this statement in the article:
I find that sometimes when people pray they completely forget to put off that old model of man.
And then he also relates a story from the We Knew Mary Baker Eddy book about Mrs. Eddy instructing her household about the importance of “putting off’ the old (material) man in our thinking instead of just trying to “improve” this material view of man.
I’ve found that a liar will eventually always be exposed. The belief of life in matter is a lie. If we aren’t proactively clearing our thinking of the beliefs of life in matter as they come to the surface, its lies come to the surface in more aggressive forms that *force* us to handle them. For example, material things all eventually die. That is the nature of matter. So if we believe the source of love in our life is some material being, we may suffer severe grief at the loss of love in our life if that material being dies. But if instead we realize our source of love is God, then we will experience continuous, never ending, never dying love in our lives. And we can know that in Spirit nothing ever dies, and therefore the true spiritual idea that may appear to us as a temporary material being never dies either. The same approach can be applied to health, supply, and any other idea that we can be tempted to believe has its source in matter. We can take joy in putting off those “old man” beliefs and realize the true idea that has been there all along and is there now, regardless of what the material (lying) senses may be telling us.
Hi Brian,
This reminds me of a short article by Mrs. Eddy called Foundation Work. Here is a quote from it;
“Early had I learned that whatever is loved materially, as mere corporeal personality, is eventually lost. “For whosoever will save his life shall lose it,” saith the Master. Exultant hope, if tinged with earthliness, is crushed as the moth.”
Ret. 32:5
Thank you for the link to the article. I am looking forward to reading it. 🙂
Thanks Kirsten! That’s a great quote. I love the references you share with us. And thanks to everyone for your comments today and everyday!!!
Thanks so much, Brian, for the link to this article by Mark Swinney. It’s just what I need and I have printed it out to for handy inspiration.
Brian,
I tune fully in to Lori`s comment.
Thank you awfully for the link to that wonderful article of Mark Swinney!
I just want to point to the following sentence at the end of the article: “So, invite God`s “new man” into your thought and be comforted” from Psalms. Let`s do that!
Thanks a lot Brian for your so inspiring and clear metaphysical comment!
Thank you for the link to Mark’s article Brian.
I particularly like the last paragraph,
” Your present spirituality, including your invincible expression of God’s perfection, can never really be your goal since it is already and entirely your present standpoint.”
A great reminder!
I have found this topic and the thread of responses extremely beneficial!
“If you mess up, ‘fess up.” Thank you Evan, Shelagh, and Brian. I am “fessing up” – have to find the old man that has to be gotten rid of, as Mark Swinney said:
“The same approach can be applied to health, supply, and any other idea that we can be tempted to believe has its source in matter. We can take joy in putting off those “old man” beliefs and realize the true idea that has been there all along and is there now, regardless of what the material (lying) senses may be telling us.”
I just finished reading Mark’s article again and highly recommend checking it out. The last line is especially helpful to me, “Your present spirituality, including your invincible expression of God’s perfection, can never really be your goal since it is already and entirely your present standpoint.” What a powerful thought that my expression of God’s perfection is “already and entirely” my “present standpoint.”
Thanks, Evan, and all for your contributions. Yes, every time we declare that we are spiritual and perfect, made in God’s image and likeness, we are putting on the “new” man and throwing off the “old.” Honesty, to me, is being pure and guileless, a quality I deeply value. I encouraged this in my children as they were growing up. They have become trustworthy adults. Forgiveness is given when we honestly “fess” up and repent—change our direction. I love this post!
Such sincere, healing reasoning here. Brings to mind this passage in Science and Health (p. 447):
“Expose and denounce the claims of evil in all their forms [especially the claims that I can be sick, selfish, sensual, dishonest, uncaring, lazy, etc.] but realize no reality in them. A sinner is not reformed merely by assuring him he cannot be a sinner because there is no sin.
To put down the claim of sin you must detect it, [fess up]
“remove the mask, [it’s only evil, the liar, claiming to use my face, identity, thoughts, voice, and heart for its own ends]
“point out the illusion [the truth is, there is no other source of identity, thought, or motive but the one all-knowing, all-caring Mind, God, infinite Love, infinite good, filling all time and space, so this evil claiming to use me is nowhere, no one, nothing, and cannot fool me into thinking it is]
“and thus get the victory over sin and so prove its unreality.”
Expose has three important meanings:
1) deprive of food (truth) or shelter (consciousness) 2) Unmask 3) subject to the action of light.
We are all of us, eternally, subject to the action of light. Good stuff!
Wow, what a lively and useful discussion. When we tell the truth we align ourselves with Truth, God.